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Form for GP seems confusing

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7 years 1 month ago #185041 by Spaceman
Form for GP seems confusing was created by Spaceman
I've been looking at the GP report form but I'm finding the tickboxes rather confusing and if I can't understand them, I can't expect my GP to, or hope to explain to him which ones he should tick.

For example, Preparing food "Can prepare and cook a simple meal unaided" could be read as meaning specifically aids or appliances, rather than prompting, supervision or assistance, so if I didn't have physical problems which require me to use aids my GP might tick Yes for that. Then "Cannot cook a simple meal using a conventional cooker but is able to do so using a microwave", says nothing about preparing the meal, so it could be read as meaning whether I'm able to just cook food prepared by someone else in a microwave. Then "Needs prompting" and "Needs supervision or assistance", well as I need supervision or assistance, prompting wouldn't help, so he might tick No for prompting, or if he ticks Yes it might be taken by the DWP to mean that prompting does enable me to prepare or cook a meal.

With Washing and Bathing, if I need supervision or prompting, would he tick Yes or No for "Can wash and bathe unaided", as I don't need to use an aid or require physical assistance?

With Mixing With Other People, if "Cannot engage with other people due to such engagement causing overwhelming psychological distress" applies, what should he tick for the three boxes above that?

For Moving Around, if I'm physically able to stand and walk but my conditions mean I'm in severe pain and limp from the outset, what would he tick there? From the guidance, I get the impression that Reliably means being able to do something without severe pain, in which case "Cannot, either aided or unaided, move more than 1 metre" would apply and certainly if I go out one day, I will be laid up on the sofa and unable to go out for a day or two after, so that I can't Reliably walk more than 20 metres.

I'm thinking it might be easier if I just ask my GP to write a letter which addresses each of the relevant categories in words, without having to try and explain to him what the descriptors and Reliably mean. So for Moving Around for example, he could explain how my conditions make it very painful for me to walk at all and that walking one day will leave me unable to walk for a day or two after, which speaks to the descriptors without specifically mentioning them.

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7 years 1 month ago #185070 by Gordon
Replied by Gordon on topic Form for GP seems confusing
DJ

The phrases used in the document are the legally defined criteria against which a claimant is assessed for PIP, we opted to use these to remove any concerns by a DM as to whether the GP understood what that criteria are.

You'll have to forgive me but I think you are over thinking this, the intention is to provide and easy framework for a GP to provide comment on a claimants abilities for PIP that is actually based on the criteria against which they are actually being assessed. I'm not convinced that your GP will make the same assumptions as you have in regard to what the statements mean!

The problem you will almost certainly have with a letter is that your GP will be unaware of the criteria and therefore may make statements that are not relevant to the criteria or simply be unable to answer.

If you need me two then can go back through the answers.

Gordon

Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems

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7 years 1 month ago #185139 by Spaceman
Replied by Spaceman on topic Form for GP seems confusing
I understand those are the criteria but but even after studying the guidance its hard for me to remember or explain exactly what they mean, so it seems unrealistic to expect a busy GP to know the real meanings, which are more legal (or at least technical) definitions rather than simple statements of medical fact. I can't see why a DM should expect my GP to understand what the criteria are anyway, all he can be expected to do is provide medical evidence that speaks to my difficulties regarding the specific activities.

Even with the explanation of "reliably" given on p.1 and assuming the GP has time to read this thoroughly and understand it properly, he's not going to know whether "cooking with a microwave" is satisfied if I can cook vegetables that have been washed and cut for me or if "preparing a simple meal" is satisfied by cooking some frozen peas in a microwave.

Likewise with "Cannot undertake any journey", he won't know if that is meant to be read literally, as in it's impossible for the patient to ever leave the house, or if it is satisfied if they occasionally leave the house but suffer overwhelming psychological distress from doing so. Nor will he know if pain, discomfort or incapacity triggered by walking should be taken into account for the "Moving Around" criteria.

So it seems far more reasonable to just ask the GP to write some pertinent comments, perhaps by guiding him as to what would be helpful and will speak to the particular descriptors that the patient thinks they meet.

A way of making the current GP Report form a bit less confusing might be to get rid of the Yes/No tickboxes and just say "Tick one of the following options". I appreciate that in some cases, such as Preparing Food, the patient might satisfy "Needs to use an aid" and "Needs supervision or assistance" but as the latter scores more points they only really need to show that this is met, although the GP can also mention in the comments any particular difficulties that require the use of aids.

You could probably also drop the first option "Can...unaided" as well, as if a patient doesn't have any issues with that activity they can just leave that page out when giving the form to their GP and I'm sure they'd appreciate us minimising the paperwork they have to consider and complete!

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7 years 1 month ago #185148 by Spaceman
Replied by Spaceman on topic Form for GP seems confusing
Another suggestion that might help clarify the "Moving Around" page is to either change it to say something like "This activity looks at my ability to stand and then move around outdoors reliably and without significant pain or discomfort or worsening of my condition as a result" (with the latter in bold for emphasis) or to add just above the list of options "The patient, reliably and without significant pain, discomfort or risk of worsening their condition..."

That way, the GP is assured that if he ticks "Cannot, either aided or unaided, move more than 1 metre" that he has qualified this and is not necessarily saying that the patient is physically incapable of moving. That should make it unnecessary for patients to have to try and explain in detail what the guidance or case law says about the criteria/descriptors (which is difficult enough if you can even get an appointment in time, let alone over the phone or in a letter) and the GP isn't being asked to just trust what the patient is telling them about what they mean when putting his name to such statements.

I think some of the other pages could be similarly qualified but certainly it would be helpful to add and emphasise "reliably" to the explanation on each page.

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7 years 1 month ago #185163 by MikeM
Replied by MikeM on topic Form for GP seems confusing
Yes, I found it confusing too ( didn't have a clue which boxes needed ticking ) didn't bother in the end , I think it needs simplifying.
Mike

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7 years 1 month ago #185164 by Gordon
Replied by Gordon on topic Form for GP seems confusing
DJ

Apologies but I think you are over thinking this.

This document is not fixed in stone; use it or don't use it, change it I f you think you need to, whatever works for you.

It's aimed at claimants who could not produce something themselves.

We know it is not perfect and we are more than happy to listen to constructive criticism from it's usage, so if you use it (changed or as is), let us know what your GP said.

Gordon

Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems

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