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ESA stopped
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2 years 7 months ago #271452 by L
ESA stopped was created by L
Good morning
So in March I started doing some permitted work. The wording on the gov website said you can no more than £143. On another part of the website it says up to 143. I earned 143 from Mar 1st until obviously the threshold was upped 1st may (so four weeks I was earning 1p per week more than I should). I didn't know about my ESA being stopped as my ESA payments were still going through up until May 9th. On May 10th I got a letter saying my ESA had been cancelled because I'd earned more than the threshold. I didn't understand at the time as I knew the threshold was 143 so I rang up and yes, I'd exceeded it by a penny (you can earn 142.99 aparently) so obviously I asked for a mandatory consideration there and then. I even told the guy on the phone about the part on the gov website that says no more than 143. He found the website where I was looking. Heard nothing apart from a text saying I'd hear back by 29th June. I rang ESA yesterday just in case they knew anything and my mandatory consideration has been declined. On top of that the lady said I'll be receiving a letter at some point regarding overpayment of ESA to me from Feb 28th to May 9th (over a grand I worked out).
I have been sent Zero letters so far. Not one saying ESA consideration has been declined, nor the one about overpayment. The lady on the phone said I could put in a new esa claim but at this moment in time I can't face that right now.
Any ideas on what next steps I can do?
So in March I started doing some permitted work. The wording on the gov website said you can no more than £143. On another part of the website it says up to 143. I earned 143 from Mar 1st until obviously the threshold was upped 1st may (so four weeks I was earning 1p per week more than I should). I didn't know about my ESA being stopped as my ESA payments were still going through up until May 9th. On May 10th I got a letter saying my ESA had been cancelled because I'd earned more than the threshold. I didn't understand at the time as I knew the threshold was 143 so I rang up and yes, I'd exceeded it by a penny (you can earn 142.99 aparently) so obviously I asked for a mandatory consideration there and then. I even told the guy on the phone about the part on the gov website that says no more than 143. He found the website where I was looking. Heard nothing apart from a text saying I'd hear back by 29th June. I rang ESA yesterday just in case they knew anything and my mandatory consideration has been declined. On top of that the lady said I'll be receiving a letter at some point regarding overpayment of ESA to me from Feb 28th to May 9th (over a grand I worked out).
I have been sent Zero letters so far. Not one saying ESA consideration has been declined, nor the one about overpayment. The lady on the phone said I could put in a new esa claim but at this moment in time I can't face that right now.
Any ideas on what next steps I can do?
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- Gary
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2 years 7 months ago #271550 by Gary
Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
Replied by Gary on topic ESA stopped
Hi L
You can earn up to £143 per week. You must not work more than 16 hrs per week; your hours are averaged over the current week and the four preceding weeks, or over the period of a recognisable cycle of work.
I would advise you to seek help from your local Welfare Rights Organisation: you can find your local Welfare Rights Organisation to help you with advice by clicking on the link below and putting in your post code, it will then come up with a MAP with a list of agencies. advicelocal.uk
Gary
You can earn up to £143 per week. You must not work more than 16 hrs per week; your hours are averaged over the current week and the four preceding weeks, or over the period of a recognisable cycle of work.
I would advise you to seek help from your local Welfare Rights Organisation: you can find your local Welfare Rights Organisation to help you with advice by clicking on the link below and putting in your post code, it will then come up with a MAP with a list of agencies. advicelocal.uk
Gary
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- Gordon
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2 years 7 months ago #271552 by Gordon
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Replied by Gordon on topic ESA stopped
Just clarify as we are talking about pennies and minutes!
Under PW you cannot work for 16 or more hours, so 15 hours and 59 minutes is fine and 16 hours is not.
I've had a look at the legislation and it says
"Work which is done for less than 16 hours a week, for which earnings in any week do not exceed 16 x National Minimum Wage"
I think a reasonable interpretation of "do not exceed" would be less than or equal to but no more than.
The NMW figure for 2021-22 was £8.91 giving a total of £142.56 however, and this is a big however, there is an additional rule that rounds the amount to the next 50p, which would round the £142.56 to £143 dead.
This rule is in the same Regulation but is separated from the calculation by several paragraphs, although it is referenced in the paragraph defining the calculation and so should be looked at as well.
So, if you earned £143.00 and no more than this then you should be OK. I am wondering if the DWP simply calculated 16 x £8.91 without the rounding which would show you over.
If you earned £143.01 or more then I'm afraid the law is quite black and white and the DWP will have no discretion to change the Decision.
References.
ESA Regulations 2008 / 45. Exempt Work
ESA Regulations 2013 / 39. Exempt Work
Gordon
Under PW you cannot work for 16 or more hours, so 15 hours and 59 minutes is fine and 16 hours is not.
I've had a look at the legislation and it says
"Work which is done for less than 16 hours a week, for which earnings in any week do not exceed 16 x National Minimum Wage"
I think a reasonable interpretation of "do not exceed" would be less than or equal to but no more than.
The NMW figure for 2021-22 was £8.91 giving a total of £142.56 however, and this is a big however, there is an additional rule that rounds the amount to the next 50p, which would round the £142.56 to £143 dead.
This rule is in the same Regulation but is separated from the calculation by several paragraphs, although it is referenced in the paragraph defining the calculation and so should be looked at as well.
So, if you earned £143.00 and no more than this then you should be OK. I am wondering if the DWP simply calculated 16 x £8.91 without the rounding which would show you over.
If you earned £143.01 or more then I'm afraid the law is quite black and white and the DWP will have no discretion to change the Decision.
References.
ESA Regulations 2008 / 45. Exempt Work
ESA Regulations 2013 / 39. Exempt Work
Gordon
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- L
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2 years 7 months ago #271559 by L
Replied by L on topic ESA stopped
Thank you very much for your reply, Gary.
My work is agency work, and I never do more than 12 hours a week. There are also some weeks I do less hours, or none at all if I can't face it. It's the amount that they've made the decision on according to the ESA lady on the phone. I wasn't aware I couldn't earn 143 a week as on the gov.uk on website it still says "earn no more than £152 per week" (changed to higher amount April 1st 2022). I'm autistic so I tend to take things literally and I just assumed the "no more than" meant including that amount. Also, I've worked out that since March when I started permitted work, I've averaged out at 56.18 per week (rounded up) and never more than 143 per week. So from March 1st- April 1st as the amount went up to 152 after that. So over 4p really had I realised I'd have my esa stopped over a penny, I'd have definitely asked for a penny less of my wages.
I submitted a tribunal request yesterday, but without the mandatory reconsideration decision letter I'm at a bit of a loss on what to do and stuck in limbo. They say they can't process it until they have that information.
My work is agency work, and I never do more than 12 hours a week. There are also some weeks I do less hours, or none at all if I can't face it. It's the amount that they've made the decision on according to the ESA lady on the phone. I wasn't aware I couldn't earn 143 a week as on the gov.uk on website it still says "earn no more than £152 per week" (changed to higher amount April 1st 2022). I'm autistic so I tend to take things literally and I just assumed the "no more than" meant including that amount. Also, I've worked out that since March when I started permitted work, I've averaged out at 56.18 per week (rounded up) and never more than 143 per week. So from March 1st- April 1st as the amount went up to 152 after that. So over 4p really had I realised I'd have my esa stopped over a penny, I'd have definitely asked for a penny less of my wages.
I submitted a tribunal request yesterday, but without the mandatory reconsideration decision letter I'm at a bit of a loss on what to do and stuck in limbo. They say they can't process it until they have that information.
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- Angel
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2 years 7 months ago #271560 by Angel
Replied by Angel on topic ESA stopped
It is also AFTER. Tax, NI and pension contributions have been paid. Net pay rather than gross. await written confirmation, then appeal. Get ALL wage slips for the past 12 months.
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- Gordon
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2 years 7 months ago #271579 by Gordon
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Replied by Gordon on topic ESA stopped
Angel
The Deductions are
1. Income Tax
2. Class 1 NI contributions
3. half of any sum paid by the employee, towards an occupational or personal pension scheme
The Deductions are
1. Income Tax
2. Class 1 NI contributions
3. half of any sum paid by the employee, towards an occupational or personal pension scheme
Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
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