transition from DLA to PIP

Hello Debbie and welcome to B & W,

As I read your post I could feel your frustration.

A little googling produced this page - it is something which you might wish to explore.

www.nucleus.org.uk/good-news-for-pip-cla...ring-appeal-process/

Although it is possible to be awarded mobility points due to lack of cognative ability, most people who are awarded it do not fall into this category.

I know you will use your ability to fight for yourself. You might find this a useful link

pipinfo.net/activities/planning-and-following-journeys

They are decisions by the Upper Tribunal which are linked to planning and following journeys. These decisions guide the First Tier Tribunal, and the DWP, as to how the PIP regulations should be interpreted. If you are going quote them, make sure you read the full decision, so that you don't quote out of context, but they can be really really helpful.

Wishing you success and please do stay in touch
Catherine

Hi Debbie

There are two different issues here - one - the going out and planning a journey and - two - driving a car.

The Going Out activity looks at three things.

Planning a route - this is primarily a cognitive or sensory (e.g. blindness) activity. You are being asked about the problems you would have with working out how to get from one place to another, you do not need to be able to follow the route that you are planning.

Undertaking a Journey - this is to do with mental health issues such as agoraphobia and social anxiety and is concerned with you leaving the house to go somewhere, they will be interested in the things that stop you doing this. You need to show that you would suffer "overwhelming psychological distress" to meet the criteria.

Following a route - This activity about the problems you would have navigating a route. So are there any problems; cognitive, sensory or mental health issues that would prevent you from doing this? This is different from undertaking a journey, in fact, if you cannot undertake a journey then you will not score points for following one and vice versa.

You will need to prove that you have a cognitive or sensory impairment in order to score here.

There are two distinct issues with a claimant driving, one that is reasonable and two that is less so.

First, the DWP will argue that someone who drives has good cognitive ability as the process of driving requires the driver to be aware of what is going on around them, to be able to pre-empt situations that they are approaching and to be able to manage the operation of the vehicle.

They will also argue that it show good navigation skills and an ability to plan a route, however, claimants might be able to argue that if only one journey is undertaken and the claimant had to be shown that route, that they are in fact not able to plan or navigate a route, but there is little flexibility in this argument.

Secondly, the DWP view driving as a physical activity, for example holding the wheel requires a level of dexterity, strength and endurance in their hands, arms, and shoulders, They also believe that the operation of the pedals is akin to walking and so someone who can drive can also walk. This argument is very weak, however, most people drive a car to go somewhere and having arrived at that place they may then need to then walk or use a wheelchair to complete their journey.

You will have to counter the above arguments and against what has been written in the assessment report to gain additional points and follow Catherine's link, pipinfo.net is a very good web site with case law but as Catherine has stated make sure you read the whole decision.

For PIP activities must be completed reliably, this means

• Safely – in a fashion that is unlikely to cause harm to themselves or to another person.
• To a necessary and appropriate standard – given the nature of the activity.
• Repeatedly – as often as is reasonably required.
• In a timely manner – in a reasonable time period.

Gary

Hi Debbie,

I also feel your frustration!

First a word of caution. The tribunal can review your whole award. It is therefore possible that it may remove or reduce points which could affect your award. This is unlikely but you need to be aware of this. Another thing you should be aware of, is that sometimes even though you have a high award for DLA, this doesn't 'translate' across to a similar award for PIP. Often it does, but not all the time. If you explain that your health is the same as when on DLA, (assuming this is so, ) and explain ongoing difficulties, this will ensure the best possible outcome for your PIP appeal.

Ok, now onto more positive information...

You haven't specified how your 10 points for mobility have arisen - was this through physical walking, or planning/following a journey?
Under planning journeys etc firstly, you will need to make it clear to the tribunal exactly what difficulties you do have, if you haven't done so already. Unfortunately, you may have fallen into a trap with DWP, (the forms/assessment questions are littered with these!) Using a sat nav, is insufficient of itself to count as an 'orientation aid' - this has to be a special gadget that only a disabled person would use - the obvious example is a white stick for someone who is visually impaired. Because a sat nav doesn't fall within the law, DWP will just use this as another excuse not to award points.

Of course, you can turn what DWP has said on its head! Since, you are clearly an intelligent educated lady, why would you need to have help when making a journey.?The obvious answer is because you have extensive health difficulties which require you to be accompanied! This all needs to be fully explained, including the nature of help/assistance provided by the person who journeys with you. Do you have extreme anxiety when on a journey, (remembering that this could be eg a quick visit to the corner shop, as well as a long trip down to Cornwall for a holiday.) - do you have a panic attack, migraine, suffer from breathlessness, feel terrified etc? - if you have any of these things, or similar problems then you may well have 'overwhelming psychological distress' - this will need to be explained.

Also remember, in case there are occasions where you can go out alone, eg to the shop to get bread and milk, that doesn't mean you won't qualify for points. Gary explained about being safe, repeating, length of time etc, - points under each PIP section should be awarded if you fail to meet the full requirements for the majority of the time, not EVERY time.

I am aware that some claimants are very anxious around people, and do not wish to encounter anyone, hence would use the car to avoid these difficulties, even though the journey is within their walking ability. If this is the case, then it is important to explain this. as well.

One final point. Under the law, DWP, and the tribunal should award the highest approriate value of points under each activity section, if more than one level applies. (Unfortunately DWP don't always do this!) This could also apply to Daily Living as well Mobility.


You are nearly at the end of your appeal journey. There is a very good chance of success at the tribunal. If you haven't done so already, have a look at the points' values set out in the members guides in respect of PIP. Explain the difficulties you have using examples, and try and fit within the framework of the various points levels. Compare this with what DWP have said in the appeal papers, (which you should already have, or will get soon.) Write this all down, bullets points are good to use. Keep this paper to hand during the tribunal, and then this will remind you to state all the valid information. You can, if you feel confident, write this as a letter to the tribunal and send it in, in advance of the hearing.

I wish you luck in your appeal. Please let us know how you get on.

LL26