Secretary of state for work and pensions Pat McFadden refused to rule-out personal independence payment (PIP) cuts or rule-in the abolition of the work capability assessment (WCA), in wide ranging discussions with the Commons Work and Pensions committee (WPC) last week.

PIP

In relation to PIP, the WPC pointed out [Q118] that, since McFadden took over, the Timms’ review terms of reference have been changed to say that spending must remain within the Office for Budget Responsibility’s forecast.  As a result:

“There is a risk that those who have engaged with this process may fear that they are aiding the axeman in respect of PIP. What words of reassurance would you give to them?”

It turned out McFadden had no reassurance to give.

When asked [Q119] why the DWP continue to claim that the Timms review is being co-produced with disabled people, when “the Social Security Advisory Committee advised against using the term”, McFadden had to admit “in a spirit of candour with the Committee, I say that in the end, the Government have to make the decisions on policy, financial resources and so on.”

And when asked [Q120] point blank:  “Can you rule out future cuts?”, McFadden replied:

“I am not ruling anything out. I have only been in the job for three months, and if I start ruling things out it will just close doors in the future, so I am not ruling anything out.”

WCA

In relation to the WCA McFadden was asked [Q115]:

“In the Green Paper, the Government said they would publish a White Paper in the autumn on the abolition of the work capability assessment. Reports now seem to suggest that that has been cancelled. The WCA is a fundamental and crucial part of the whole system, so is that correct? Why the change and how are we going to move forward if that is not the case?”

McFadden could have simply responded with something along the lines of “We will be bringing forward separate legislation at a future date to deal with the abolition of the WCA.”

Instead, he obfuscated: 

“There were a number of changes in July, as the Committee is well aware. It meant we had to re-look at how we were taking these things forward. The Committee will be aware of the establishment of the Timms review. We may come on to that, but he will consider the whole question of PIP, with the other reviewers. There are some elements of the Green Paper that are now being looked at in a different way.”

Whilst McFadden’s response certainly doesn’t say the idea of abolishing the WCA has been ditched, it does suggest that it is no longer the certainty that it was on publication of the green paper.

Unemployment insurance

McFadden’s wariness in relation to the WCA was certainly not matched when he came to talk about changes to contribution-based benefits, where he explained [Q127]: 

“. . . I am enthusiastic about the idea of recreating more of a contributory unemployment insurance element, non-means-tested, based on your contributions as part of the system. I think it is a good idea. It is an idea that we hope to take forward next year. It is pretty simple: for a limited period of time, people with a good national insurance contribution record will be entitled to such a benefit.”

Under-22s

Nor did McFadden have any problem about admitting that Labour has not yet made up its mind about whether to prevent claimants under the age of 22 from accessing the health element of universal credit, another idea consulted on in the green paper [Q130]:

“We have not made a decision on that—not to repeat earlier answers—but the whole issue of young people, sickness, unemployment and work is within the terms of what I have asked Alan Milburn to look at in the next few months. It is in there and I do not want to make a decision on it until we have looked at things in the round.”

Mired in uncertainty

The impression McFadden gave, though certainly not intentionally, is of a department mired in confusion and uncertainty following the backbench revolt on PIP cuts earlier this year.

The minister is pretty certain they will go ahead with the introduction of unemployment insurance, but everything else seems to be no more than a “maybe” at the moment.

And, given the increasing likelihood of there being a new prime minister in place next year - and possibly a whole new team running the DWP – that’s probably wise.

You can download the transcript of Work and Pensions Committee Oral evidence: The work of the Department for Work and Pensions, HC 344

 

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  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 12 days ago
    Rather  Labour than the nasty Reform/Tory coalition who are serious about killing off all welfare once and for all, for disabled, sick, unemployed, and migrants. At least Labour is doing things step by step and bringing concerned people along through reviews and consultations. Kemikaze, Bob Generic and Nigel Fartage don't give a hoot about us and our lives, our dignity. Many horrible Brits see us as scroungers and support them! I'm more terrified of them coming in as they want to slash the state to bits like Trump.
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 21 days ago
    Do we know if this affects New Style ESA?

    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 19 days ago
      @Michelle Thank you for clarifying - much appreciated.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 19 days ago
      @HL From what was originally said, I thought the "unemployment insurance" is what ESA new style/contributions is expected to become....meaning ultimately still national insurance based, but time limited...I thought I saw somewhere originally that indicated it would also depend on income eg, if you had a partner who worked, but haven't seen that mentioned in a while. So those of us relying on NS ESA due to loosing a career due to ill health will have no safety net if they have no other income.
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 21 days ago
    I am getting absolutely scared stiff of the future now because of this pathetic government, it's almost they are literally trying to scare people to death.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 20 days ago
      @Neil Apologies to one and all at B and W I am really scared about the fact that McFadden is determined to target disabled people as I have mentioned several times before the need to take action is now, lobby the local Labour MP, start a Government petition as this is affecting half a million people like myself who will be reliant on family for financial support if there are no legal challenges to be made. Lobby the disability charities,  go to a legal welfare expert to challenge this do anything positive. I have tried so hard to write to local people my own MP does not care and I am mentally and physically tired of life if this is not stopped.. Why should people on contributory benefits system like myself there are just under half a million people.  too ill to work like myself be forced to lose over £7,000 a year alongside others in the same situation. Like the above I am at a mental low point apart from being physically disabled. I have to pay for private treatment to keep me well. Please I humbly ask someone to start a  Parliamentary petition on the Government's own website. We are all decent human beings and we need to take a collective stand against the Government to oppose any changes that impact on all disabled people.   I implore you all to unite against the Government to stop them. Apologies I am a scared isolated autistic individual who lost all hope after trying so hard to take a moral and ethical stand . It terrifies me the disabled are always the first made to be targeted for political expedience (convenience).
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 20 days ago
      @Neil Neil don't despair we have a long way to go.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 20 days ago
      @Neil Neil they are more interested in the under 25s getting them jobs, they are less bothered about us oldies who are towards the end of our working lives.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 21 days ago
      @Neil Hi Neil, I can totally relate - it’s all really concerning isn’t it. I’m trying to stay in the here and now and I find that attempting to keep up with what’s happening - thanks to B&W - helps somewhat. Here’s a link to an excellent (and free) Yoga Nidra website, just in case it’s helpful! I find it really works to calm anxiety, and for sleep. ☺️
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 21 days ago
    I note the article says this:

    In relation to the WCA McFadden was asked [Q115]:

    “In the Green Paper, the Government said they would publish a White Paper in the autumn on the abolition of the work capability assessment. Reports now seem to suggest that that has been cancelled."

    Do we know what those reports are? 
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 21 days ago
    When Labour were in government previously we lived in an area where there was a trial of people on Incapacity Benefits who had to have 5 meetings about a month apart with a Job Coach to see what they could do to get you into work. I remember going with my other half who was booked off work, and the Work Coach started off with "When you get better..." and I answered "There's no cure for his condition. It only gets worse..." By the time we got to appointment no. 4 it lasted about 5 minutes as they realised it was a complete waste of time. The trial was ditched. I suspect Labour are going to try and resurrect something like this for those in the LCWRA group which makes me shudder.
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 21 days ago
    Motability has announced that with immediate effect luxury car brands including BMW, Mercedes, Jaguar and Land Rover will not be available on the scheme.

    And by 2030 25% of cars on the scheme will be made in the UK, and from 2035 50%.

    The increase in UK made cars will include a doubling of the number of UK made Nissan cars. 
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 21 days ago
    I think the point of the Timms review is to cut PIP spending and when PIP daily living replaces the WCA, UC health spending too. Or as they spin it make disability benefits sustainable so the genuinely severely disabled who are unable to work can be protected. And stop people taking the Mickey or being left on the scrap heap.

    Going on about the Timms review and PIP in answer to a question about abolishing the WCA. Is in my opinion indicative of them planning on abolishing the WCA and using PIP daily living component as the eligibility criteria for UC health element.

    On young people he repeatedly went on about people choosing the door that leads to being trapped on benefits rather than being helped into work. Which I think is indicative of going forward with the plan to remove or reduce what they view as perverse financial incentives to be disabled, and not abandoning people to a life trapped on benefits.

    If I had been on the committee I would have asked McFadden to resign for his comments in a media interview where he called young people on disability benefits a disease and unaffordable burden on society. Rhetoric straight out of the history books. As we should not forget where such rhetoric leads. 
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 20 days ago
      @John John,
                Apologies Sir but you come across as a very clever and knowledgeable individual who maybe has the insight into how the Government can be made to back down. The Whole Green Paper as you know  did not properly consult disabled people. This Unemployment Insurance proposal is a lot of nonsense and has to be challenged. If you have any ideas then please make a positive suggestion. As you said you have a lived in experience of looking after ana caring for those with disabilities. There has to be a way forward to stop McFadden. I do not and have never trusted him. If you have any suggestions Sir I would be glad to hear them from you Sir. As the musketeers used to say one for all and all for one. Apologies I meant that as a compliment if we disabled people can unite. I saw only a couple of left wing Labour MPS uniting with the Greens making publicity about the wealth tax. The disabled need to talk to journalists any MP willing to back the disabled.  Collectively as a whole group there is the talk of PIP Cuts/ Unemployment Insurance. etc  that should be the starting point as a way of engaging with the MPS, any organisations or legal welfare experts willing to support all disabled people impacted by proposed benefit cuts.  All these These welfare changes have to be opposed that impact on all disabled people. Or even lobby the House of Lords. Anything that can be done to mobilise opposition to any welfare changes. Sir. 
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 20 days ago
      @John
      I'm well aware of what McFadden is like and the Labour right more generally. But the sort of arguments you outline for how they might try to get cuts through are exactly the same arguments they were trying in the summer, and look how that turned out. Someone posted an article a few weeks back which quoted MPs who rebelled back then saying that they will do so again if the government tries anything which will push people into poverty. McFadden, despite his reputation as a supposed fixer, is a key figure in a leadership whose authority has already been shot to pieces and will very probably be even further eviscerated at the elections in May.

      Quite apart from anything else, if McFadden had simply said "the reports are wrong, we're still going to bring forward a bill to abolish the WCA", he would have been doing nothing more than reiterating previously stated government policy. Whoever the government of the day is, if suggestions are made that the government is quietly dropping a previously stated policy, governments are usually only too quick and eager to dismiss such reports and make it clear that they're wrong and the policy still stands if that is indeed the case. By contrast, when they refuse to confirm that the policy still stands and they start to obfuscate instead, as McFadden did here, that has often turned out to be the first clear sign that the reports were true and the policy has changed. Whether that turns out to be true in this specific case we'll have to see, but refusing to simply restate existing policy is certainly strange.    
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 21 days ago
      @tintack I am far more pessimistic.

      McFadden is not someone with any expertise in disability benefits who has been given the job to take a fresh look and change policy. He is a disciplined, efficient, ruthless political fixer according to people who like him. A man you send in when the going gets tough to get the job done. He has been made DWP Minister to get the planned changes through parliament not be a bleeding heart and change course. And he has been repeating the narratives used to justify the planned changes, ad nauseum. Meanwhile Timms and Milburn are there to provide political cover so MPs can claim it is based on consultation and experts, that it is fair and for the best, about helping people into work and ensuring the welfare system is sustainable so it is always there to help those who cannot work. When the results of their consultations and expert evidence gathering are foregone conclusions given their known opinions at the outset and required results. It's a stitch up.

      If you want to know Starmer's desired direction of travel look at the Labour Growth Group of MPs. They are a group of Starmer loyalists and cheerleaders, who it is has been claimed are actually just a government front to promote policies Starmer wants, not a naturally occurring group of back bench MPs with common interests and ideas of their own. They want even more cuts to welfare in particular disability benefits than have already been announced.  
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 21 days ago
      @John
      "Going on about the Timms review and PIP in answer to a question about abolishing the WCA. Is in my opinion indicative of them planning on abolishing the WCA and using PIP daily living component as the eligibility criteria for UC health element."

      That was already the original plan though - if nothing has changed in that regard, then McFadden could simply have said "yes, we're still going to bring forward a bill to abolish the WCA". He didn't. 

      I suspect the realisation has begun to dawn that conflating disability and incapacity benefits is a recipe for chaos and disaster, and that conflation is precisely what happens if UC Health (an incapacity benefit) is made dependent on a component of PIP (a disability benefit). They are fundamentally different benefits designed for different purposes. There will always be people who are incapable of work, which means there will always need to be an incapacity for work assessment of some kind. The PIP assessment can't be used for that purpose, as PIP isn't an incapacity benefit and its assessment therefore cannot assess incapacity for work. If the WCA is abolished but not replaced by some other incapacity for work test then there will be no incpacity for work test anywhere in the system.

      It sounds very much as though they reached for this nonsense in desperation a few months ago on the assumption that it would save them a few quid, they're only now starting to realise that it's completely and utterly unworkable, and they simply have no idea how to get themselves out of the hole they've dug. Not least because they know that if they come forward with anything that would plunge a lot of vulnerable people into poverty they will run into a repeat of the summer's rebellion, especially with a leadership whose authority is in the toilet with Labour now tanking so badly in the polls, even compared to just a few months ago. 
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 21 days ago
    It looks like the government are seriously considering implementing 'the unemployment insurance benefit'. Which will result in anyone claiming this benefit being time limited. Currently under ESA (CB) support group there is no time limit.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 20 days ago
      @Anon I’m definitely going to raise this issue with my MP in the new year . It’s ludicrous and I will do anything I can to bring this forward . I want this legally challenged. 
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 20 days ago
      @Helen Galloway Hi I am sorry if I caused you any distress, all of us as disabled people need to use the disabled activist local groups to co-ordinate and lobby Parliament over the next few months. Anyone one of you who can suggest any form of positive action I beg you I worry not for myself but for millions of disabled people. We have human rights which are being breached by law and the important thing is to remember tactically how McFadden puts forward these proposals he has to be stopped at any cost. Look at the Motability impact. I leave it for someone else to take the initiative and stop this. 
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 20 days ago
      @Helen Galloway It's a worrying time. Hopefully all will become more clearer in the next few months.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 21 days ago
      @Anon Yes it’s really awful it’s hanging over our heads I’ve got an awful lot going on at the moment personally and I’m trying to get a bipolar diagnosis and navigate another load of nonsense like government bureaucracy. But my MP’s office still haven’t got back to me from earlier on in July when I asked about this benefit. They were very helpful but obviously haven’t had any response from DWP I aim to get an answer certainly in the new year I won’t stop until I have it. 
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 21 days ago
      @Helen Galloway Yes, As I mentioned last week nearly half a million people will be impacted by this unemployment insurance benefit who are on CB ESA. I am being pushed mentally to breaking point as this will leave me and others like myself destitute. I am really very scared why change things the way they are. People on New Style ESA worked all their lives and like myself too unwell to work. I do not want to live to an old age where the disabled are treated so badly.
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 21 days ago
    This is a marked contrast, with an expectation, as you are calling it, that draws disabled people into conditionality. The new deal for disabled people was voluntary but still managed to get tens of thousands of disabled people into work—and successful work; up to 12% over three years sustained employment. Why have you decided to draw this into a conditionality regime? Also, going back to my first question, what considerations were given to safeguarding in this regard?
    Q126
    Good question from Debbie Abrahams re the planned employment support programme. 
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 21 days ago
    It may not seem like good news but when it comes to what the DWP are planning on,trust me as someone with many years experience, kicking the can down the road is the best you can hope for. Like a stay of execution. 
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 21 days ago
    With regard to McFadden not ruling out cuts to PIP. Having just spent the best part of almost two years going through dishonest assessments (one of which so obviously made up, that was paid compensation for it by Capita). Then, to put myself through the mandatory reconsideration process, only to be awarded a few extra points that amounted to no actual award. Followed by a submission to Tribunal, and the DWP’s offer of the bare minimum of points. And finally - at tribunal to be awarded both Daily Living and Mobility at the higher rate.

    What I wonder, is just how much money was spent on that entire process? 
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 21 days ago
      @Unknown Error Make a FOI request..... i bet it would make very interesting reading. ( obviously it can't be case specific) so itd be something like how many cases are given awards at tribunal? How many cases are rejected at tribunal? What is the breakdown of the awards given at tribunal etc

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