The DWP appeared upbeat about the progress of managed migration when they appeared before the commons work and pensions committee last week, claiming the failure rate is within a “tolerable limit” and close to zero.  However, they still resorted to cheap tricks to make it harder for the committee to get to the truth.

When asked about the managed migration of employment and support allowance (ESA) claimants onto universal credit, Neil Couling, the Senior Responsible Owner for Universal Credit, told the MPs that “It might surprise the Committee, but we already have about 100,000—just a tad over…Out of 900,000 ESA people. We have got them on to universal credit.”

Couling claimed that nobody on ESA was being left behind.

“The attrition rates are basically zero if your concern was people who were not claiming. About 96% of people do claim, but you have a natural rate of termination of that . . . That is the normal rate. We are basically getting people over on to universal credit, with the exception of tax credits, which we have spoken about before, I think, at previous hearings. For ESA, it is almost complete; I do not want to say it is absolute, but it is within a tolerable limit.”

It is definitely good news that so far the drop out rate for ESA migration is very low.  But if the DWP had automated the process and transferred claimants over themselves, then there would have been no failure rate at all. Let alone one that the DWP regards as within a “tolerable limit”.

But one concern is that the DWP have only transferred 100,000 ESA claimants since September, a period of around 5 months, but they are now increasing the migration rate to over 60,000 a month.

Couling says that they can handle the increased rate of telephone claims, explaining “Normally, telephony claims run at 2% to 3%. We are seeing 15% and 16% for ESA, but we would expect that. We are set up to handle that, because you have lower rates of digital capability and awareness.”

But there is also the issue of the very considerable amount of staff time that needs to be devoted to claimants who do not respond to a migration notice, or who drop out part way through the process. 

As Couling set out “If people do not respond to our migration notice and they are on ESA, we do not switch off their entitlement to employment and support allowance without attempting further contact. We send text messages, where we have phone numbers. We contact other parties—social services and others—who may be in contact with the claimant. We check our old records to see if we have any routes in. If none of that works, we then offer a visit, and we try to visit the claimant.”

As month after month of very high volumes of migrations are begun, the concern is that DWP staff will not have the time to go through this rigorous process for every ESA claimant who is unable to engage, and corners will start to be cut by staff under pressure to stick to the very tight migration timetable.

Because it is definitely the case that things still go wrong.

Last November, the DWP announced that it had introduced a technical fix to ensure that ESA claimants would not be required to provide fit notes and that they would also be transferred to the same group, limited capability for work or limited capability for work-related activity, in UC.

Yet, Benefits and Work continues to hear from a smaller – but very definitely not zero – number of people for whom this is still not working.

Two weeks ago, Martin told us that he was asked “to provide fit notes pending a new health assessment”. 

Another commentor in the past fortnight said that his son, who has had a brain injury for almost thirty years has been asked to attend a jobcentre and provide evidence of his condition.

And H told us just yesterday that his brother, diagnosed with learning difficulties and autism and who is in the support group, has been asked to provide a fit note.

So, there is definitely reason for scepticism when the DWP say that everything is going smoothly for virtually everyone.

And that scepticism is likely to be increased by the underhand tactics employed by the DWP to avoid scrutiny.

In November, after their last meeting with the department, the work and pensions committee wrote to the DWP asking a series of questions “about how the most severely disabled people are going to be protected” during managed migration.

The DWP chose not to reply to that letter until the very last moment, at 6.45pm the evening before their meeting with the work and pensions committee.  As the chair of the committee, Debbie Abrahams, remarked at the opening of the session

“That did not really give Members an opportunity to review it. I will ask specific questions on the transitional protections for severely disabled people a little bit later on.”

That the DWP’s tactic had worked was evident when Abrahams did later ask about transitional protection. Abrahams had clearly failed to understand that claimants do not have to apply separately for it.

This meant that she was unable to continue with any further questions, saying “I will re-check the wording. Obviously, I have had only a short time between receiving the letter last night and being able to speak with you today.”

That the DWP chose to use this cheap lawyers trick to avoid scrutiny of what provision they have put in place to protect vulnerable claimants possibly tells us more about managed migration than their claims that the failure rate is almost zero.

You can read the transcript of the work and pensions committee session here.

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  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 6 hours ago
    Let's be honest here the migration except the letter they send is managed by the claimant themselves. Hardly managed by the DWP except for messages to someone in administration who is probably to overun to do much. 
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    · 12 hours ago
    Despite both being parts of the DWP, the UC department has no access at all to our ESA records. Hence why we have to tell them so much when migrating. The migration process is like making a new claim for a different benefit - because that's exactly what it is. It is not a direct transfer from one benefit to another.

    Furthermore it is VITAL TO STATE IN THE JOURNAL that the migration is from ESA SG to UC LCWRA (or whichever other benefits are involved) and to mention regulation 19 (the one about not needing to show fit notes). Put nothing in the journal and you'll likely endure needless rigmarole.

    This information is from a message posted in my journal by some random person working for the DWP. 
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      · 4 hours ago
      @T Very true T. The point I'm making is that mentioning regulation 19 and transferring from the SG to LCWRA means the DWP has no excuses to get it wrong therefore avoiding unnecessary stress and anxiety. My migration was tickety boo too, but we know there are those who aren't so lucky. 
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      · 4 hours ago
      @T Why did you have to put down your disabilities/disorders, surely that is already down on the previous benefit, you are just migrating over to another. Not sure why they need to know that during the migration process. They aren't assessing us again, are they? 
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 4 hours ago
      @WorkshyLayabout Thankyou .. WSL .. s.. thanyou again ...s ....
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 5 hours ago
      @WorkshyLayabout Thank you for your advice. I am ESA LCW so I would say I am migrating to UC LCW. Isnt't it shameful though that we have to go through this rigmarole?
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 8 hours ago
      @WorkshyLayabout When I migrated I ticked to say about being in ESA support group. 
      There was also a part where you put what disabilities you have.
       Other than that I didn't have to mention anything else and thankfully I've migrated without any problems.
       Got my first statement and lcwra element was automatically included. 
       I appreciate mine was a relatively simple migration though and maybe not everyone else with have it as smoothly.   The guy dealing with my transfer knew exactly what he was doing (in Liverpool). 
       I hope I wasn't just lucky because I hope the migration I had could be the same for everybody. 
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 15 hours ago
    I’m doing the migration 2 weeks on Saturday so I will let everybody know about the esa tick box fit notes demands commitments etc etc good bad or an outright shambles I will write a comment to finally put everybody mind at ease and mine also 
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 5 hours ago
      @Scorpion I have a provisional license which I used for id, just upload the details plus I did the credit questions ie when you opened certain accounts (fortunately one of the answers is over five years ago because no way I can remember that) when you took out loans if you ever have, that kind of thing. All pretty simple and that was it
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 9 hours ago
      @Sam Do you mean I can also submit my ID through their damn journal and don't necessarily need to go to my local job centre to hand these to them?

      Thanks for the information. Very helpful for those of us who haven't received the migration letter yet.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 11 hours ago
      @James h It's a surprisingly simple process, especially if you have photo id. Not had my first UC payment yet but the last ESA sg payment came in as it was supposed to two weeks after my claim. Only hiccup has been I'm not apparently having part of my new payments be cb ESA or new style ESA. Turns out if you've been in the sg for several years you've built up enough national insurance credits to qualify. Not had to agree to a different claimant commitment though. Not had any contact with the DWP other than through the journal. No calls or visits which was a big relief 
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 21 hours ago
    So after months of waiting for disability 3 billion cuts now she has been forced to shelve cuts due to backlash  and court cases which would have come I’ve always said dwp high court case  (Clifford) they lost was much much worse than some people thought when you looked closely at case 
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    · 22 hours ago
     "They also believe that there has been a complete failure to keep in touch with those currently deemed too sick to work and believe that there is mounting evidence that even the simplest conversations with work coaches can have a positive impact."

    That's not true, as the last person I would like to have any conversation with is a so-called patronising unqualified poorly trained work coach, whom I can teach the ABCs of life but who thinks he knows better than me simply because I'm on benefits and he can play with my benefits to my detriment.


  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 22 hours ago
    “This Labour government will fix the broken benefits system because getting more people into good jobs is crucial to improving their living standards and life chances, and getting the welfare bill on a more sustainable footing.” - The DWP ministers.

    Why can't such "good jobs" be given to the 88.000 people who are currently on jobseekers allowance and who are looking for jobs good or bad, to start with, if there's any truth or honesty in this rhetoric?


  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 1 days ago
    "Last November, the DWP announced that it had introduced a technical fix to ensure that ESA claimants would not be required to provide fit notes and that they would also be transferred to the same group, limited capability for work or limited capability for work-related activity, in UC.

    Yet, Benefits and Work continues to hear from a smaller – but very definitely not zero – number of people for whom this is still not working"

    Sorry B&W, but that simply isn't true, or at the very least disingenuous of those claiments migrating and reporting as such.

    I am in no way defending the DWP as an institution,  but their fix dies work in 100% of cases. I've done the migration (and helped with many others) and if you select the option confirming you're already claiming benefits, it comes up as a automated message that you do not need to provide fit notes: it recognises you as a person are migrating.

    This is a fact.

    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 23 hours ago
      @Michael No, it's not a fact.  Just stating something is a fact doesn't make it so.  

      I've just googled the automated message you refer to and found a link back to the site we're on now. 

      The article is dated 18 October and refers to the (actual) fact that in spite of the automated message appearing on the migration form, Neil Couling, DWP head of the UC team, admitted the DWP is sometimes illegally requiring managed migration claimants to produce fit notes and even agree to work commitments.

      So, that automated message is not proof of anything at all. It is clearly not a "system coding that works 100% of the time" as you say, it's just a page on a form.  The DWP now claim they have fixed the problem - but they would, wouldn't they?

      And work coaches have zero authority to make a "manual intervention" requiring someone to attend a WCA, they don't get to make those sort of decisions.  Anyway, the DWP have been absolutely insistent that no-one will be required to attend a WCA as part of the migration process.  Or are you saying that isn't the case either and work coaches can pick whoever they like to be sent for a WCA as part of their migration?

      And absolutely nobody has the power to require someone who is in the support group to agree to work commitments that's just plain illegal.

      I may be gullible, as you say. But I'm definitely not so gullible as to believe someone who writes with utter certainty, but provides not a single shred of evidence to support their claims - or their undermining of other people

    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 1 days ago
      @Terry But it does mean EXACTLY that. It's a system coding that works a 100% of the time. It doesn't decide to just change things behind the scenes for a select few.

      Unless there has been a manual intervention and they've requested them to attend a WCA,  forcwhatever reason, the system itself works 100% of the time. That is a fact.

      Don't be so gullible to pretend people aren't disingenuous.


    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 1 days ago
      @Michael That automated message was already there when the DWP admitted mistakes were still happening, so your claim that it's 100% effective is just not true. 

      Just because a message pops up on your screen doesn't mean that it translates into the correct actions being taken elsewhere.  In particular it absolutely doesn't guarantee that the work coach you have to deal with has been properly trained and knows what they are doing.

      The idea that you know precisely what has happened to every one of 100,000 claimants because you have been migrated yourself and have helped some other people with their migration is nonsensical.

      And to accuse other posters of being disingenuous when they are reporting their experience - just as you have reported yours, only without being accused of being in some way misleading - is cruelly unsupportive.  People shouldn't be attacked for sharing their experiences here, there's plenty of other sites available for bashing claimants.
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 1 days ago
    A decent, compassionate and caring government would have just automated the process for everyone.
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    · 1 days ago
    Only removal of the Errosion of Transitional Protection would convinced me, things are going in the right dirrection!
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 1 days ago
    Reading the comments below I am glad it is going well for some. Not us. Firstly my son was notified he would receive CB ESA. He has never worked , claimed when he was 16 and is now middle aged. Sent off his migratory request. Was advised he would receive exactly the same amount as he was getting. He didn't it was over £11 short. Then received some more money which bears no relationship to what he was told. UC have permission to speak to me but they can't answer questions on ESA.
    Wrote to DWP with a letter from my son confirming he wanted them to speak to me. An hour on the phone and they did but just said the money was incorrect and arrears would be paid although they don't appear to be included in the last payment. Trying to persuade my son to phone but this is difficult because he has little or no memory and won't remember what is said to him. Worse still being on CB ESA he will have to pay for his prescriptions and to have his eyesight tested both of which he needs. The DWP think they are doing well, I beg to differ
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 1 days ago
      @c.lloyd@btintern If you go online to tge goverment website you can apply for a certificate free of charge for perscriptions eye tests and glasses and dental i think it is called a hc2 it takes about 10 minutes to do and tge certificate will last for the year and then you apply again a month before it runs out I had tge same issue and now apply for a cert every year which covers me and my carer. Just look under prescription costs on gov.uk 
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 1 days ago
    Are they doing this on purpose with the asking for sick notes, as a sneaky way to reassess people that haven't had an assessment in a long time.

    I wonder nothing would surprise me.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 21 hours ago
      @Frances No, it's not that they want to send you to reassessment. it's because the ESA hasn't sent out your record to them yet and until they receive this for them you're not different from a fresh UC claimant, unless you clearly inform them on your journal that you were in the support group.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 1 days ago
      @Jenny My post was cut. Trying again:

      Question is, would they be allowed to reassess on the basis of those fit notes, when they shouldn't have demanded them? It's all such hard work, and, especially, putting things right when the dwp have got it wrong is a real challenge.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 1 days ago
      @Jenny @Jenny i been thinking that too they either can’t be bothered or they want to reassess people again to sneakily throw them off the support group 
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 1 days ago
    I have epilepsy&special needs&I can’t work . It’s all hard I just wanted to post a comment to say sorry some of you are struggling and please stay strong 
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 1 days ago
    Would it be a good idea to make a note on the UC managed migration application that we should be getting Transitional Protection, in the same way we should say we don't have to supply fit notes if we are in ESA Support Group? We could also state what our full current ESA entitlement is, including all the separate elements and premiums, which should be retained after migration, and add Housing Benefit too if we get that. This way we could make clear what our total entitlement is before managed migration, insisting that the UC total award amounts to the same. We should not be any worse off on UC until the Transitional  Protection is eroded by benefit rate rises (which we will not get) and increases in rent (which will not be covered by UC Housing Element).

    At least then if UC get it wrong initially we can refer them to the note on our application which might save a bit of time and stress and make it easier to explain to UC if they mess it up and we're under pressure. It would also mean we had a ready made case to put to any advisers we use. We could go 'Hey, look, we explained this already and UC have still got it wrong''.

    Quoting the regulations seems to have helped with the fit note problem, so maybe being assertive from the start about our new benefit entitlement having to match our current one would do the same.
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 1 days ago
    I have been asked to provide a fit note, worse still job centre staff didn’t know that the support group existed.  I would encourage everybody to if they can to use the guides available on this site and to make use of the CAB help to claim service.  Just remember a fit note triggers a whole new assessment of your claim-scepticism definitely!
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 1 days ago
      @Dan Dan So what do you plan to do?job centre staff didn’t know the support group existed it’s been around for 17 years since Labour introduced esa in 2008
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 1 days ago
    They can now be officially called the ‘Red Tories’  Not once ounce of credibility left.
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 1 days ago
    The Dwp only lie .. words kill.. when far right thinking prevails ... only fools win .
    Everybody else suffers .. time to stand up and be counted vulnerable disabled group . What a colossal voice is simply waiting to be heard.. it will frighten new labour local mps ..  TO their very core .. frightening bullies .. human rights ..  * Here my Complex vulnerable disabled people come ! 
    ... s ... 
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 1 days ago
    Only have 3 weeks left before I say goodbye to esa look out for my post 1st march i will be standing firm and not backing down if they insist I need fit notes from doctor or they don’t recognise my current claim 
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      · 1 days ago
      @James h I hope you have someone supporting you!    Do not give up.   Have you contacted your local MP, and ask for their intervention?
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 1 days ago
    Mine started out smooth but then had a message on the journal stating they couldn’t find my ESA records and that if i was claiming the benefit to contact my local jobcentre, after hours of waiting still didn’t get through and gave up, contacted the CAB after numerous times as they are super busy and even they had issues contacting ESA. We called Universal credit aswell and the rudest lady answered, thank goodness the CAB was on the line with us. 

    Got my last ESA today and they 

    They also neglect to mention the little trip to the jobcentre to prove ID and everything which im bricking. The last time i went there they shouted at me for standing in the wrong line. 
  • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
    · 2 days ago
    I'm currently migrating to Universal Credit and so far have had a very smooth transition.
    On the online form there is a question asking you if you are migrating from ESA, and then a message came up saying you don't need to provide fit notes.
    But after reading the stories on here, I made sure to also put a note on my journal saying I'm not required to provide fit notes, and I would recommend that everyone does the same.
    Also, I've read comments from a lot of people who are worried about the ID check because they don't have photographic ID.
    I did my ID check this week and I didn't have photo ID either, so I took in my bank card, most recent bank statement, most recent ESA letter and birth certificate, and these things were enough. So if you don't have photo ID, try to take these other things in if you can.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 12 hours ago
      @Scorpion Some people are stuck with a mindset of permanent negativity.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 21 hours ago
      @Jim'snotdead I don't understand either why some have downvoted you. The funny thing is that you even see people downvoting someone who is just asking a normal and legitimate question.
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 22 hours ago
      @Jim'snotdead @Jim'snotdead If a comment stated bananas are curved and yellow, someone would down vote it. 
    • Thank you for your comment. Comments are moderated before being published.
      · 1 days ago
      @Jim'snotdead Nice of people to downvote me when I'm just trying to give some advice...
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      · 1 days ago
      @Scorpion My committments were: complete all activities in my to-do list
      report changes to my circumstances promptly, including changes to work

      No requirements to look for jobs or take part in work related activities